When Jeff Tucker assumes his new role as associate pastor at Christ Church Lutheran in Phoenix, AZ, he’ll start on a path his father has been treading for nearly three decades. His father, Bill Tucker, is senior pastor at Concordia Lutheran in San Antonio, where he’s served for 20 years. Join the Tuckers as they share their thoughts on life in ministry with host Pastor David Schultz.
Transcript
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Welcome to engaging truth. This is Dave Schultz, your host for this evenings program on father's day night of all things, we are doing something special this in the month of June, and that is talking to pastors and sons who have become pastors. And I welcome to the mic this evening, um, father and his son, and this something special because this father and son, the son has just graduated from this seminary and is ready to accept his first assignment, uh, and call, uh, so bill Tucker, welcome to the mic.
It's good to be with you, dude. Thank
You. And your son, Jeff. Welcome Jeff.
Thanks very much. I actually just submitted my letter of acceptance. So I'm officially in, I think.
Okay. Um, bill, I'd like to ask you what in the world was it that brought you into ministry so many years ago?
You know, David, there's a long story that goes with that, that, uh, we don't have time for, but essentially when I was, uh, when I was in high school, I thought I was gonna be maybe a, a position or something like that. And I felt a very, uh, very powerful, very clear sense that God was calling me into the ministry instead.
And that was it. Then that was the inner call. Um, and then the external call came later from the seminary. Jeff, you are the, a son of a pastor of a very large church and it's probably in your ministry. You'll never come to a church that size other than to see your dad. What brought you into ministry? Jeff?
I think pretty early on in my life, I felt called to, uh, ministry and some capacity. I, I don't know if that was always pastor. Um, and then I, I would say my life since then has been me trying to actively resist it until, uh, until it got to a point where I just felt like I was, um, almost being negligent. And I, I just believed that, um, gotta put that passion for ministry on my heart. And I just stopped saying no is really how I got to here.
Bill, you have been in probably many different settings. Uh, tell me about the settings and how they, that relates to, to where you are now at Concordia.
Well, there there've been lots of different ministries. We, we, our first call from the seminary was to a very, very small congregation at the Southern boundary of the Northern Illinois district, uh, town called Maral in the congregation called Trinity while we were there, we actually planted a mission congregation about 30 miles to the west in a, in a, a joint conjoined town called lasal Peru. Um, and then sometime later, because we had made a commitment that we would not accept any call to that congregation alone, which was kind of a crazy thing to, to agree to at the time, but we were young and foolish. And so we did, uh, we, we then took a call to St. Paul in Mount prospect and we served there, uh, for a little over 12 years until we came here to Concordia.
So you've been in Concordia. How many years now? You know,
In November it'll be 20 years.
Wow. Um, very seldom. Do you get those long enduring calls anymore? Guys come and go after five or six years, seems to be, uh, the, uh, the, the rule Jeff, you just graduated from the seminary and, um, that's a big step to step in to a church somewhere where is the congregation that you'll be going to serve in ministry?
Uh, I was called to Christ church Lutheran in Phoenix, Arizona, and I had the, the good fortune of doing my, uh, vicar year at Christ church with, uh, pastor shrink. So in a sense, it's a, it's coming back home. This is where my wife has been for the last year, while I've been finishing up school. So I'm excited to be back.
That is a moving congregation. It's probably one of the few that does things that out of the box, you know, that's true. Not just once in a while, but all the time. Uh, but, but that's great. You know, that's what ministry's all about. That's oftentimes what, what helps to draw some of the people who are on the fringes? Do you know what you, your responsibility will be Jeff, as you go into ministry there?
Uh, well it's, as you said, we kind of do things out of the box. So I don't know that I have a, a specific role nailed down. I'm an associate, but I, I imagine, uh, my passions are kind of for, uh, working with marginalized people, groups, and, uh, helping people kind of attain, uh, basic necessities and, and connect them to, uh, communities that can just help them with daily needs. So I imagine I'll be doing a lot of that and then
I'm gonna give you a comment that I want both of you to comment on. I'll begin with, uh, pastor, bill, give me a time and situation that something
That started out difficult or going in the wrong direction right itself and became right for you in ministry, pastor, bill. Wow. Uh, that sounds like the pattern for most of the adventures in ministry that I've had. Um, but the one that's most, most currently on my mind right now, David, is, is COVID 19. Uh, it was a, for tremendous struggle for everyone. I don't think anybody would disagree with that. And yet with God's blessing and the, the hard work of a team here with our church, school childcare, tiny tops, the entire, uh, faculty and staff, uh, we've been very blessed. And while we've still got lots of challenges to overcome a as we head into this, this next season with inflation and everything else, I think it will be challenging, but I will tell you that it it's, it's becoming easier and easier to see many blessings that have come out of the challenges.
And, and just one to name an example, because because parents couldn't walk their children into school, uh, the, the, the staff of the church were greeting all of the families as they arrived and helping the kids out of the cars and getting them into the school. And as a result, our whole church staff became very, very well acquainted with the kids and with the, the families in a way that we, we weren't before we knew them, there was acquaintance, there was family, many of whom are church members, but it created a, a connectedness that is a tremendous blessing.
That's really a neat story. Um, Jeff, you have not had an awful lot of opportunity in ministry yet you were in Vicarage. Explain a little bit about what Vicarage is in. Was there something during those Vicarage years that, uh, that looked ugly and it looked like clouds were forming and all of a sudden the Lord turned it into something good?
Sure. So the, the first part of that question Vicarage is really, uh, an internship and a chance to get your feet wet and, uh, try a number of different things and to fail often and to figure out kind of where your passions lie in pastoral ministry. And honestly, to see if it's a good fit, because I think a lot of guys go in and, uh, some don't always make it through the Vicarage or, or they get done with Vicarage and, and they find out that pastoral ministry is not the right calling, but to, uh, to go to the next part of that question, we started a, a food pantry in probably September when I first started. And that was kind of an initiative that I was passionate about helping people with food insecurity and when COVID happened, you know, uh, what would that be? Probably like four months later, five months later, everything shut down, uh, everything on campus shut down.
We, we could really only do zoom calls and, and, uh, some kind of social distance visitation. Uh, but the one thing that kept going, because it was considered essential was food pantry. Now that grew from when we first started, we were serving 30 families. And when COVID happened, we didn't know if we'd be able to keep serving those families to in the, during the pandemic, we were serving, you know, a couple hundred families each week. Uh, so it, it grew kind of exponentially to help meet a need in the community. And that enabled us to kind of, um, be in contact and build relationships with families that would never have set foot on our campus, but were kind of driven to our campus because we were able to meet an essential need in that moment.
Give me a heartfelt moment in ministry, uh, bill, pastor, bill, that you can never forget something happened somewhere. That was a heartfelt moment. And, um, it's something that as we older pastors consider can never forget
My goodness, David, there are so many, you know, I'm a, I'm a kind of an emotional guy anyway, and can get easily choked up at any number of things. Uh, so the, the privilege of baptizing, my kids, those are tremendous heartfelt moments. You know, I think of, uh, uh, the marriage of my children, my goodness, what an amazing blessing in the, that's just thinking from the context of family and father's day and all of that, uh, those kind of moments happen all the time because you, you really are invited into the most tender, the most, uh, fragile moments of people's lives, the most precious moments of people's lives. And, and when you have connection with them, when, when you love them and care about them, it's hard not to be touched by it and, and hard not to sort of form a memory that lingers.
One of the things that I always noticed in ministry, uh, over my many years was what happened at weddings. Um, when the vows were made and the bride, the groom were looking at each other, that we as pastors could almost tell how successful that marriage was gonna be, by the words that were spoken, then isn't that true bill?
Well, I don't, I don't know about predicting the success of the marriage, but I will tell you that those moments I are very, very special. You get to be standing right there in close proximity. And you, you not only hear the words you see, uh, the love, you see the connectedness. I will tell you David, that the, the image as all three of my kids were speaking their vows to our beloved, uh, uh, daughters and son, um, the, the, the picture of their faces is indelible. Yep. Uh, each one of them,
The picture on their face is indelible. I like that phrase that's that says an awful lot. Um, you've had some wonderful joyful experiences, uh, some, something that doesn't go away. Jeff, have you had any, yet, uh, in your Vicarage years, just, um, an experience that just is indelible in your mind that never goes away.
Uh, yeah, I mean, there were, there were plenty of really, uh, kind of eye opening moments. I would say for me, because we, we have some level of, um, tragedy in our family. I, I was able to lead a, a step group, which is part of celebrate recovery, and it's, it's really kind of walking guide through, uh, the different steps of recovery from any variety of addiction. And I, I, I guess I would just say it's not one specific moment, but watching kind of those men and myself open up and, uh, build real relationship and to walk with them and, you know, the story doesn't always have the cleanest or, or happiest ending, but to see kind of, uh, them starting a new chapter of their life and having hope and kind of, um, kind of turning their lives around in, in a lot of ways. And for me to be able to heal from some things from my past, along with them, it, it was just a rare opportunity where I felt, uh, men, my age and older could kind of gather around and, and talk honestly, and openly and, and find healing that it can be hard to find in the real world.
Well, I know you, pastor bill have experienced probably a hundred or a thousand different situations that are indelibly imprinted, but does anyone kind of rise above the other as it relates to ministry and the proclamation of the word?
You know, I think of, I think of, um, family situations where, uh, a spouse would come in and talk with me about their, their husband or their wife who was not a believer and, uh, encouraging them and committing to pray with them and agree and prayer for God to touch their hearts. And, and then some years later, in fact, in, in the case of one lady in our very first call, uh, she prayed and prayed and prayed for years. And, uh, finally one day her husband walked in and I, I honestly had no idea what was going on or why he was there until after the service. He said, pastor, I want to talk to you about being baptized. And, uh, that dear lady was standing just behind him and the tears were flowing and she was just, uh, she was just overjoyed.
Uh, I, I think these are the things that Jeff is gonna experience in the course of his ministry, too. Things that just take you by surprise, and you have to say it wasn't man. It was the holy spirit working in a special way. And that particular person's life, um, I've had so many of those that, um, I can reminisce on those as I fall asleep at night, or as I wake up in my devotions in the morning. Um, I would like to ask a question about, um, from, especially from, from pastor bill, you've been in many different congregational settings and, um, there have been times that you probably said, or didn't say, but thought, oh, maybe I should just walk away from this, but you didn't, but you didn't. There are probably young men in maybe middle aged men in ministry, pastor, bill, who are considering that because of the difficulty, give them some hope, give them some, some joy, uh, that you've experienced in going through difficult times.
Well, the first thing that I would say is God is faithful. And, uh, we need to, we need to make sure that we're spiritually healthy and spiritually strong, and that we're leaning into his amazing gift of grace. But the other thing I would say, David is, uh, ministry. Isn't the only way to serve pastoral ministry is not the only way to serve God. And so there are times when, when it's appropriate, there are times when God calls men who are serving in pastoral ministry to do other things, and rather than sort of putting a box around, uh, those folks who might be struggling, I would say to them, take the Lord and prayer, uh, gather with your, your trusted, most trusted advisors who will tell you the truth about things, and then make a decision because there's nothing worse than feeling trapped in ministry. That's not the, that's not the reason to serve, uh, being free to live in God's grace and know that, that your identity before God doesn't depend on, on your vocation, your identity or God, your, your first and most important vocation is a child of God who loves you completely and freely because of grace, because I think there's a tremendous power and a tremendous joy in realizing I don't have to be a pastor.
I choose to be a pastor because it's, it fits with gifts and passions that I have that are, that are my gift back to God as a, as a redeem sinner.
Jeff, when you look at your dad and your mom and your siblings, what one thing as you go back in life, uh, did your dad say that you can never forget
Pastor, bill you're butt, ready to send your son into ministry. What thing could you say to him on this recording that others may hear, that will be a blessing for him and them as well?
Hmm. Well, I mean, the thing that I tell him all the time is that I love him, uh, that he is to a wonderful gift to our family as is all of his siblings. Uh, I, I would also say something like what I said just a moment ago, David. And that is Jeff. You are, you are a child of God and his grace for you. Doesn't change based on your vocation, uh, that grace gives you the freedom to be who you are and to, to love people and to love God and to serve without fear. Um, and, and I would say to him that I'm really proud of him, but I'm not proud of him because he's a pastor. I'm proud of him because of the man that he is.
And that's the other thing that I remember, even when I decided at the end of undergrad, that I didn't want to go to seminary. I wanted to work for a while. There was never a pressure by him to be a pastor. He said, I, I don't need you to be a pastor. You know, I think you have many gifts. Like if, if you wanna be a pastor follow through with that, but don't think you should do it because it's something that I want. So I think him giving me that freedom was, was really empowering and knowing that, uh, kinda like what he said, there wasn't a box around me that there were a million different things I could do with my life. And if pastoral ministry is what I felt called to and, and found joy in, then that was something I should pursue.
Technology has changed things Dramat over the past year. Uh, we know things today that we didn't know, uh, 12 months ago. And I'm sure with technology, uh, on the advance, it'll be different five years from now or five months from now than it today. Um, when we look at ministry in that sense, what can you say, pastor bill that, um, is an encouragement to especially, uh, young men who might be thinking in terms of this is a difficult job. I don't know if I want to continue, um, with technology of that word gets every place in the world. What encouraging words could you use to them?
Well, I would just, uh, I think what you're say is what would I say as it relates to technology you
Yes,
Uh, use, use the opportunities available to you. And if you don't have gifts or interest in technology, then find people who will help you with that. That's right. Is the, the, the chance to share the gospel around the world has never been as open or, uh, possible as it is now. Just an example, you know, there are, there are people who are a part of our congregation who are literally around the world and they, they will never, many of them never set foot on our campus or in our sanctuary. And yet they worship with us. They engage with Bible, they connect in small groups. And so the possibilities are endless. And that's where I would also say to people who maybe don't feel called to be in pastoral ministry. Your church needs you. If you have gifts in technology, we need, whether you do it professionally, or whether you volunteer those gifts, the church needs you to, to help us leverage the, the ability we have to share the hope of Jesus with the world.
We've just got two minutes left. And Jeff, I want to ask you a question. We can't see around the corner, but what do you see as you look around the corner? What is the hopeful thinking that you have about tomorrow?
Oh, wow. That's a good question. Um, I don't know. I don't have a lot of answers to really anything. I'm, I'm new to all of this. And, uh, there are a lot of men that are, uh, better equipped with better gifts. I think I'd find comfort in knowing that Jesus really just ask me to continually ask the question, who is my neighbor and how can I serve them? How can I love them? That's the easiest way to kind of introduce the hope of the gospel in a tangible way in our world, apart from, you know, proclaiming the gospel and its fullness. So I think for anyone listening, ask yourself, who's my neighbor. And, uh, you can find a lot of hope and joy in serving them.
We have just a little over a minute left you in this particular 24 minute time. Uh, and I just wanna say thank you for being with us and thank you for being willing to hear and say, what is on your heart, pastor, bill, would you close it with a prayer please?
Sure will. Heavenly father thank you for this opportunity and for this, uh, technological blessing to be able to share, uh, the hope of the gospel and thank you for my beloved son, Jeff, and, uh, for his gifts and talents that you will use in powerful ways, bless us and bless all, all who serve, bless your people. And Lord allow the message of the gospel to spread round the world in extraordinary ways by the power of your spirit in Jesus name.
Thank you for coming to us this evening on engaging truth. Come back again next Sunday night. Thank you. And good night. Thank you for listening to this broadcast of engaging for be sure to join us each week at this time, to help support our ministry, contact evangelical life ministries, post office box 5 68, Cypress, Texas 77, 410, or visit our website@elmhouston.org, or find us on Facebook at evangelical life ministries. Thank you.